Inappropriate?
Ahh, finally someone asked for it. I have been contemplating writing this post for quite some time, but I feared it would be too risky. But after getting the following question, I decided to take the leap:
“Hey I was wondering if someone could write a blog about when it's appropriate to contact a recruiter and when it's not appropriate to contact a recruiter. Like maybe you could write a top ten list of annoying things you see people do commonly?”
I have surveyed my team and come up with some common complaints. While I’m happy to say that I don’t have enough complaints for a Top 10 list, here are a few of the top common themes:
- If you are going to reach out to a recruiter, please do your homework. We get cold-calls from people all the time who found a name on the internet and call up to talk about their career hunt. If you are going to call someone you don’t know, be thoughtful of their time and call them with relevant questions. (This advice goes to recruiters too… there is nothing worse than a cold-caller who doesn’t know a thing about you).
- Same is true for the internet: while an email is less invasive than a phone call, please customize your letter so that you are contacting “me” and not just a random email address you found.
- Don’t treat your recruiter like they are stupid. Yes, we know that recruiters are not as technical as engineers, but we want and deserve some respect, just as you do. We are your advocate, not your roadblock- remember it.
- Know when to back off. Yes, we love persistence, but some people take it too far. It’s a recruiter's job to be polite, so after we tell you a “delicate no” a few times, you should back off.
- Don’t lie. I have covered this one on the blog before, but I’ll say it again: recruiters can spot lies a mile away. If you think you have a new one, we promise you that you don’t. It hurts your credibility.
- Are you sick? This is overwhelmingly common. People often come to an interview telling you how they are sick, or getting over a cold, or jet-lagged or tired. While this may often be true, we suspect it is a thinly veiled cover-up for nerves and an early excuse for poor performance. We understand you may be under-the-weather, but don’t start the day with excuses. We have heard them before.
I’m ready for the comments to fly about the inappropriate things recruiters do… so go for it. I’ll summarize the best ones in my next post.
- Jenna
17 Comments
justanopinion said:
Things the recruiter's could improve:
1) Not contacting the candidate back, with a decision fast enough., while providing vague timelines ( you should hear back something in the next 2-3 weeks).
2) Transparency of the hiring process(hires/no hires) not communicated to the interviewee.
3) Hard to get reply back fast enough(within a couple of days..isnt that a normal expectancy for emails?). I understand that the email inbox may be flooded, but even a short reply would be nice, and filters for current candidates could push those mails up :)
Apart from that, I believe recruiters are your friends, and want you to get HIRED :)
scotsgirl said:
Hi Jenna,
I'd just like to say thank you for this post. I have been wondering the very same thing for a while and have recently been in touch with a Microsoft recruiter. I'm glad to say that I didn't commit any of the 'offences' you mention (I think!!) But will definitely bear these points in mind for the future.
Cheers, scotsgirl
King said:
Is it normal to have a campus recruiter tell you "if you don't hear back from me in six months, please contact me?" I submitted a resume by mail and got this response.
wronglyright said:
Well i think usually everyone has their point of view, but i fully disagree with most of this ...
1. A soft no itself is bad, since the candidate wouldnt mind a hard no, instead of being in a "second life" kind of world waiting for opportunities.
2. A recruiter need not be polite, instead a recruiter needs to be responsive, proactive and true, after all thats what most candidates need.
3. Microsoft is not heaven, there are millions of other places where people can grow better, and teach things better, so please dont glamorize things as though for everyone, the final destination is microsoft (yes its a rich company).
4. Lies cannot be spotted if the conviction of a lier is strong, so this "scare me" technique will not work, lies cannot be spotted in 90% cases. If recruiters are great in spotting lies, then why do we have a lie detector ? How many recruiters have made it to the FBI/CIA (Stats required)
5. Nobody considers recruiters are dumb/stupid, after all if they are true, responsive and proactive then there is no reason why a candidate will give issues, yes there will be 10% people who might but thats a normal thing. Most people who are dumb/stupid, usually try to announce regularly that they are not dumb/stupid. Has any intelligent/successful person ever been bothered about how much others thing him/her as dumb/stupid ? since they dont care, all they care for is their work ...
6. If recruiters are over burdened , then either the number of open positions be reduced or atleast the number of recruiters increased. Microsoft is rich, cant it hire more recuriters ?
Piyush said:
Hi Jenna
Speaking of etiquettes, when is it appropriate to press your case for reconsideration? Sometimes you feel that you really did your best, the conversation was very positive but then you get an unexpected "after careful consideration...". Especially accompanied by a reason that does not feel right. (e.g. "The team was looking for more experience in web services" hey but we hardly spoke about web services!) What is your advice about requesting reconsideration - at least another phone screen?
said:
wronglyright is so smart he posted twice. Nice....
Sean Kearney said:
I'd like to add this. I've had the opportunity to chat with a few Microsoft recruiters. All in all, they're human like the rest of us. They can make mistakes. I have yet to say I have ever "dreaded" talking to one.
I have of course had the "OH MY GOD IT'S MICROSOFT!" Jitters, for me, that just goes with the territory. But all in all, I've been kept in the loop. I've learned the first lesson, follow up, but don't freak if they don't repond within 33.37 seconds.
If you don't get a response at all, leave it at that. There was a reason. Somebody may have goofed and is too afraid to say it (Remember the human aspect of it?)
To Microsoft recruiters, I expect to run into quite a few of you over time, each time is a new adventure.
One which will be worth to effort in the end to all... ;)
Sridhar said:
I have to say that I agree with wronglyright on certain points and feel that some points are totally overboard.
A soft no itself is bad, since the candidate wouldnt mind a hard no, instead of being in a "second life" kind of world waiting for opportunities.
>I strongly feel this is the case. I deal with recruiter in a rational basis and I expect a similar response. Candid response. Now I might feel offended, but it is better to have heard an honest opinion than not hearing anything at all.
2. A recruiter need not be polite, instead a recruiter needs to be responsive, proactive and true, after all thats what most candidates need.
> This is certainly true.
Now, I had gotten a polite recruiter. I went for personal interview in Silicon Valley. This was quite unlike the MS interview. There were couple of telephonic interviews with Redmond and most of the interviewers were in a hurry. I just had a couple of personal interviews and all of them with non-technical staff. I reported this and mentioned that it is quite unfair. I just got a polite reply. I do not think that is quite fair considering how stressful interviews are in general and technical interviews in particular.
Final point: Just like a recruiter can spot a lie from a mile, an interviewee can spot a lie from atleast quarter of a mile.
That would badly reflect on Microsoft. Interviewers are ambassadors of MS and they have to represent it in a smart fashion by being open and honest.
Thanks!
Sridhar
bay area PM said:
after being flown up to the mother ship for a full day of interviews and not one word back from the recruiter - how unprofessional. Yes, I followed up with him but never heard back from my follow up.
Sarah said:
This entire post has been very illuminating. I'm in the midst of my first interaction with a recruiter, and need all the "inside baseball" insights I can get. Being reasonable and reasoned in your expectations also seems to be a good credo--candidates may be nervous, recruiters may be swamped beyond belief, but neither person may have a full appreciation of what the person on the other side of the desk is experiencing.
My boiled-down takeaway is to "treat others as you would like to be treated," which applies to both candidates and recruiters, eh?
Kim said:
Sometimes I feel like it is hard to get a response by applying online. I feel like my resume is going into a black hole. For this reason it is hard not to become overbearing once you have made contact with a recruiter because you want to make sure they remember you.
Sean Kearney said:
Well here's a simple but obvious tip. No matter how much you want the job? Keep your enthusiast under control! A technical interview is still an interview with somebody who needs to see your abilities AND your professionalism. Good chance at some point in your career you might actually encounter a customer or be able to communicate.
Show your manners.
I learned the hard way. But you can't just "give up" on any job. Take every interview as a lesson learned. If you have the talent, it will take you far.
Still trying and learning from my mistakes... ;)
Kai said:
I don't know if the process is slight different when a recruiter speaks with an experienced professional or a student. The fact is that when I was a student, the universe was narrow and had some kind of "goals" as ideal company. Today, mi vision is other, my interests have changed a lot.
Other thing to cosider is culture, if in Latin America crossing borders is a real adventure, considering a supposed common root. A great division could be found when speaking from US to a latin american, european or asian candidate.
¿What is the common behavior expected from a potential candidate when he gets at the managerial interview?
¿Is a policy to notify about job fillment or not? Three times I had an interview with Microsoft, first it was clear the requirements were focused on people who were more involved in C++ development as me at that time. The second time, Microsoft rearranged their business and closed and opened positions, so the position I was applying for was filled from inside and a couple of friends I knew were moved from one place to another, the recruiter informed me in both situations and ask me to be in touch. The third time, I never heard what happened but months later when a friend told me that the position was in suspense and the qualifications reviwed for having a university teaching background for the candidate as mandatory. So I suspect not all recruiters behave the same.
Gerd said:
no Travel cost reimbursement?
Hello.
Why is there no Travel cost reimbursement from microsoft?
I filled the required forms but I haven't heard back from Microsoft. It's been more than 30 days.
What is the proper procedure?
Around here (Germany) I can start legal proceedings immediately. Thats the law. Microsoft may not like it, buy thats the law.
Bye
Josh said:
I don't work for Microsoft, but believe this isn't quite the place to voice your concern over being reimbursed for travel expenses. I would venture to think that the appropriate people to solve your opportunity are not monitoring this blog.
Depending upon your reason for the reimbursement, I would contact the person who sent you the form, or that department. Worse comes to worse, I would call instead.
Threatening legal action isn't a way to get someone to "pay up", it only puts them on the defensive and they will re-evaluate why they were going to pay you in the first place.
Sree said:
Hi Jenna,
The only complaint I have is that I feel that some recruiters do not empathize with the candidates.
It can be very emotionally stressful experience to the candidate if they are not communicated regularly (and more importantly Clearly and Honestly).
Communication from recruiter is extremely important from the point a person is selected for an initial phone interview until that person actually ioins Microsoft (if offered a position).
Just a small mail saying "I will get back to you by <date> - or if you do not hear from me by <date> please contact me again". Would be very helpful.
thanks,
Sree
PS: I currently work for Microsoft and I was hired last year.
King said:
I meant to say I submitted the resume via email.